Theos-Talk Archives (November 2006 Message tt00843)

Brahmacharya????????????

Who think that?
Not me for example.

Christina










--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "carlosaveline" 
<carlosaveline@...> wrote:
>
> Ken, Friends, 
> 
> 
> Thanks. Useful information about Helen Zahara. 
> 
> I guess the 1978 edition of "Perfume of Egypt", which I have, is 
the only one around. So far I have had no evidences that it has been 
editorially "adapted" and "purified" from the racist paragraphs CWL 
wrote. 
> 
> Helen Zahara's actions in this regard are what was candidly 
called "tampering" by the  Adyar leaders themselves in the 1960s.  
Otherwise Helen Zahara was a good and dedicated theosophist, I 
guess. I have good references of her.  
> 
> History has shown that some AdyarTS people have a way of 
justifying everything.  I will give you an example. 
> 
> For years Krishnamurti had 'adulterous relations' (Mary Lutyens' 
expression) with Rosalyind,  the wife of his best friend Rajagopal,  
while the whole world thought he as a Brahmacharya.  Yet I have 
heard Adyar people saying that the "blame"  for that  must be really 
ascribed to... the husband, of course! 
> It was all Mr. Rajagopal's fault. 
> 
> This is Krishnamurti's  thesis about that, and Mary Lutyens', and 
so on.
> 
> The same happens with Leadbeater's absurdities, of course.  
> 
> For some people, it is very hard to really think.  They have an 
absolute obedience to the corporation and blindly follow its party 
line.   
> 
> 
> Rationalizing is the "unlimited trick", always available. 
> 
> 
> Carlos. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> 
> Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> 
> Cópia:
> 
> Data:Mon, 13 Nov 2006 18:42:12 -0000
> 
> Assunto:[Spam] Theos-World Re: CWL AGAINST BLACK/INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
> 
> > Carlos - Christina et al -
> > 
> > The publishing policy at Quest Books initiated by Helen Zahara 
when 
> > she came around 1970 was to edit out all negative racial and 
ethnic 
> > comments, especially in the writings of Leadbeater, though I 
think 
> > also in Jinarajadasa's introductory book on Theosophy. There are 
> > examples in most of CWL's writings, but it is difficult to find 
the 
> > originals of some to compare with.
> > 
> > Ken
> > 
> > 
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "carlosaveline" 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Christina,
> > > 
> > > Please look at the pages 167 and 168 of your "The Perfume of 
> > Egypt", TPH 1978 edition, and you will find these quotations 
which I 
> > comment below:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ooooooooo
> > > 
> > > Leadbeater says about "red indians": 
> > > 
> > > "Of these many tribes had adopted a kind of squalid 
civilization, 
> > but many others were still savages untamed and untamable ? men 
who 
> > regarded work of any kind as the deepest degradation ? who hated 
the 
> > white man with a traditional, unrelenting hatred, and (strange 
as it 
> > may seen) more than reciprocated the boundless contempt of the 
blue-
> > blooded hidalgo of Spain. It will be no doubt incomprehensible 
to 
> > many of us that a half-naked savage can entertain any other 
feeling 
> > than envy for our superior civilization, however much he may 
dislike 
> > us; but I can only say that the quite genuine and unaffected 
feeling 
> > of the Red Indian towards the white man is pure and unmitigated 
> > contempt." 
> > > 
> > > But CWL proceeds (p. 168) to develop his unbrotherly view of 
human 
> > beings: 
> > > 
> > > "Then came the negro race ? no inconsiderable portion of the 
> > populations, and chiefly in a state of slavery, though the 
> > Government was doing all in its power to remove that curse from 
its 
> > territories; and last and worst came what were called the half-
> > breeds or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed, as mixed 
races 
> > sometimes do, to combine all the worst qualities of both its 
parent 
> > stocks. Indians, Spaniards, and Negro alike despised them; and 
they 
> > in turn regarded all alike with a virulent hatred." 
> > > 
> > > We can see in these words some strong `pioneer elements' for 
the 
> > future ideologies of Nazism and Fascism, and ultimately for the 
mass-
> > murder attemtps of "ethnic cleansing". Look at it again: 
> > > 
> > > " (...) and last and worst came what were called the half-
breeds 
> > or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed (...) to combine all 
the 
> > worst qualities of both its parent stocks." 
> > > 
> > > This is Leadbeater. 
> > > 
> > > Brazil has been from the very beginning a miscigenation people 
and 
> > indigenous people here never present resintence or hated the 
white 
> > people. Their culture was too primitive for that, say. We have 
never 
> > had important racial tensions or hatred in Brazil, aas such, 
though 
> > there was social violence. 
> > > 
> > > Miscigenation is part of the preparation for the next sub-
race, as 
> > HPB writes in the "Secret Doctrine". 
> > > 
> > > Regards, Carlos. 
> > > 
> > > De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > > 
> > > Para:"theos-talk" theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > > 
> > > Cópia:"carlosaveline" carlosaveline@
> > > 
> > > Data:Mon, 13 Nov 2006 11:00:40 -0300
> > > 
> > > Assunto:[Spam] Theos-World CWL AGAINST BLACK AND INDIGENOUS 
PEOPLES
> > > 
> > > > Dear Friends, 
> > > > 
> > > > This is about Bishop Leadbeater and his imaginary adventures 
in 
> > South America. 
> > > > 
> > > > C. Jinarajadasa believed he was there with Leadbeater in a 
> > previous body, and that he was his biological younger brother, 
who 
> > was allegedly killed and 'rediscovered' by CWL in Ceylon. 
> > > > 
> > > > In fact, in a footnote to his autobiographical Postface in 
the 
> > book "The Seven Veils of Consciousness", C. Jinarajadasa states 
that 
> > that the true story of his own "previous (and glorious) death in 
> > Brazil" is narrated in the chapter "Saved by a Ghost", of the 
> > book "The Perfume of Egypt" (2). 
> > > > 
> > > > C.J. believed everything CWL said, and he also writes in the 
> > note that the same old silver crucifix which is mentioned in 
that 
> > story was in his possession, as he wrote "The Seven Veils of 
> > Consciousness". 
> > > > 
> > > > As to Leadbeater, in the preface of his 'The Perfume of 
Egypt", 
> > he makes a solemn statement: 
> > > > 
> > > > "The stories in this book happen to be true." 
> > > > 
> > > > Along "Saved By a Ghost", the longest story of the volume, 
> > Leadbeater proudly describes how he killed numerous black people 
and 
> > indigenous people in South America during his youth. 
> > > > 
> > > > Of course, common sense says that the story is as illusory 
as 
> > the visits Leabeater made to physical plane civilizations in 
Mars 
> > and Mercury. 
> > > > 
> > > > But even if it were presented as a `short novel' pure and 
> > simple, and not as an autobiographical narration, the content of 
the 
> > text reveals too much of racism and disrespect against black 
people, 
> > indigenous people and their right to live. Leadbeater also uses 
the 
> > term "race" not in its theosophical meaning, but in the 
> > nationalistic way, as if each country had its own 'race', 
> > anticipating what Adolf Hitler would do decades later. 
> > > > 
> > > > At p. 167 of the Adyar edition, one starts to read his 
> > description of Brazilian people: 
> > > > 
> > > > "First came the descendants of Spanish and Portuguese 
> > conquerors ? a haughty, indolent race; a race courtly and 
> > hospitable, by no means without its good qualities, but yet one 
> > whose strongest characteristic was an immeasurable contempt (or 
the 
> > affectation of it) for all other races whatsoever". 
> > > > 
> > > > The amount of illusions-per-line is outstanding here. 
> > > > 
> > > > First, Spanish people were never `conquerors' in Brazil. The 
> > country was `discovered' and made a colony by Portugal. Second, 
> > Portuguese people are not a race; and they cannot be easily 
> > described as `indolent'. Third, Portuguese people generaly did 
not 
> > show `contempt' for other `races', and it is for this reason 
that 
> > miscigenation ? intermarriage ? was from the first the main 
> > anthropological characteristic of the emerging Brazilian nation. 
> > Portuguese people easily created strong personal links with 
black 
> > people and indigenous people. (Of course, colonization was also 
> > violent.)
> > > > 
> > > > In the next paragraph, "bishop" Leadbeater is even more 
> > surprising: 
> > > > 
> > > > "Next came red indians". 
> > > > 
> > > > Well, there are no `red indians' in Brazil, although the 
term is 
> > very common in old North American Far West bang-bang stories, in 
> > which hundreds of "bad" Indians get typically killed by a few 
white 
> > men usually presented as brave heros. 
> > > > 
> > > > Leadbeater says about "red indians": 
> > > > 
> > > > "Of these many tribes had adopted a kind of squalid 
> > civilization, but many others were still savages untamed and 
> > untamable ? men who regarded work of any kind as the deepest 
> > degradation ? who hated the white man with a traditional, 
> > unrelenting hatred, and (strange as it may seen) more than 
> > reciprocated the boundless contempt of the blue-blooded hidalgo 
of 
> > Spain. It will be no doubt incomprehensible to many of us that a 
> > half-naked savage can entertain any other feeling than envy for 
our 
> > superior civilization, however much he may dislike us; but I can 
> > only say that the quite genuine and unaffected feeling of the 
Red 
> > Indian towards the white man is pure and unmitigated contempt." 
> > > > 
> > > > What are the problems in these few lines? First, again comes 
the 
> > Spanish `hidalgo' (nobleman) apparently ruling Brazil, a country 
> > which was independent from Portugal (not Spain), since 1822, and 
was 
> > never under any "Spanish' ruling class. Second, the `red Indian' 
> > again. Third, indigenous people and did not express hate against 
> > white people, and never actively resisted the domination of 
European 
> > rulers in Brazil. These two paragraphs simply can't refer to any 
> > South American country. 
> > > > 
> > > > But CWL proceeds (p. 168) to develop his unbrotherly view of 
> > human beings: 
> > > > 
> > > > "Then came the negro race ? no inconsiderable portion of the 
> > populations, and chiefly in a state of slavery, though the 
> > Government was doing all in its power to remove that curse from 
its 
> > territories; and last and worst came what were called the half-
> > breeds or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed, as mixed 
races 
> > sometimes do, to combine all the worst qualities of both its 
parent 
> > stocks. Indians, Spaniards, and Negro alike despised them; and 
they 
> > in turn regarded all alike with a virulent hatred." 
> > > > 
> > > > We can see in these words some strong `pioneer elements' for 
the 
> > future ideologies of Nazism and Fascism, and ultimately for the 
mass-
> > murder attemtps of "ethnic cleansing". Look at it again: 
> > > > 
> > > > " (...) and last and worst came what were called the half-
breeds 
> > or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed (...) to combine all 
the 
> > worst qualities of both its parent stocks." 
> > > > 
> > > > This is Leadbeater. 
> > > > 
> > > > But -- what about Theosophy? What does esoteric philosophy 
> > really say about the relations between rich and poor nations and 
> > among all different ethnical groups, with their varied kinds of 
> > colours in the skin? In the "Letters from the Masters", the 
famous 
> > letter known as coming from the "Great Master" says: 
> > > > 
> > > > "To achieve the proposed object, a greater, a wiser, and 
> > especially a more benevolent intermingling of the high and the 
low, 
> > of the Alpha and the Omega of Society, was determined upon. The 
> > white race must be the first to stretch out the hand of 
fellowship 
> > to the dark nations, to call the poor despised `nigger' brother. 
> > This prospect may not smile to all, but he is no Theosophist who 
> > objects to his principle" (2) 
> > > > 
> > > > One can only conclude, then, that in writing that paragraph 
> > Leadbeater was "no theosophist". 
> > > > 
> > > > In fact, Leadbeater's vision of human beings as presented in 
> > that long story is not only ethically and culturally 
unacceptable. 
> > It is also legally criminal, for racism and stimulation of 
hatred 
> > among people of different skin-colours has been defined as crime 
in 
> > Brazil a few years ago. 
> > > > 
> > > > One can understand why the Brazilian edition of "Saved By a 
> > Ghost" cannot be found in Brazilian bookshops any longer. Yet it 
is 
> > still for sale at Adyar, it seems. 
> > > > 
> > > > ( In another posting, I should refer to Leadbeater's proudly 
> > alleged acts of violence leading to death, which, even if seen 
as 
> > fictional, are profoundly untheosophical. ) 
> > > > 
> > > > Best regards, Carlos. 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > NOTE:
> > > > 
> > > > (1) "The Perfume of Egypt", by C. W. Leadbeater, whose sixth 
> > edition (TPH Adyar, 265 pp.) is dated 1978. 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > (2) "Letters From the Masters of the Wisdom", compiled by C. 
> > Jinarajadasa, Adyar TPH, first series, Letter number one, known 
> > as `the Maha-Chohan Letter' or "the Great Master Letter'. 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > E-mail classificado pelo Identificador de Spam Inteligente 
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> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
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> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
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