Theos-Talk Archives (October 2008 Message tt00709)

Thank you Brian for taking your time and sharing things with us, you 
sound like you speak from experience which is really what matters at 
the end.

[But on a side note, how many groups, that offer "Initiation", are 
actually authentic?] 
I would say none, true Initiation can never be offered or selled. 

[What does even Initiation mean? To you ?] 
A transformation of bodies and opening into a deeper dimensions of 
life, added knowledge, powers through the help of a Guru?

[Can you even become a true initiate via the TS?] 
I think yes, since it's up to the individual to make the effort of 
preparation.

[And what is the differance between an Adept and an Initiate?] 
I don't think there is any.


[My Vedic (initiate)Guru thinks all THeosophy is "Poppycock" and new 
age twaddle, so because he was initiated by someone, that means his 
word is Truth? Or does that invalidate HPBs teachings? He also thinks 
the idea of "Pre-Vedic" is "Poppycock"! Yet Ive experianced the 
direct opposite( and have half the time of study he has). So which 
of "us" is correct? Neither? Both? Either or? Things are never so 
clear and cut, in this world of Illusion]
I think it's clearl that your Guru is not that very well informed and 
maybe a little bias.

Alex


--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Brian Scanlon <byondthis@...> 
wrote:
>
> Brother Alex,
> 
> Dont look for my crude wording within HPBs work. Look for the 
essence of what true "Initiation" means as well as the "process" of 
initiation, and you will find your own answer (and perhaps your own 
Master). To know initiation is to know how to "live" and how to "die".
> 
> My only advice, is as Ive been told. And that is to at LEAST 
practise your Pratyehara daily, while doing your "Book study". Or you 
will simply be trapped within Exoteric shackles.
> 
> The vulgar term "Self" Initiate, is perhaps....misleading slightly 
as well, due to the common exoteric definition attached the 
term "Self". 
> 
> I shouldnt/cant do anyones homework for them (and that is said with 
110% positive intention) and searching for your own answer and path 
is best (SD1 and 2 contains the information). And please only accept 
what I say as Truth, if you experiance it, for your "self".
> 
> 
> Im not here to "convince" anyone of anything. Im simply sharing my 
perceptions and experiance, that has accumlated over the last 25 
years of study and practise, of the Esoteric Tradition. Please take 
them on there own merrit or lack of (and that can only be determined 
by trying and/or experiancing).
> 
> Never has the statement been made by myself that, teachers and 
initiation are not needed, for ones spiritual journey. But I have 
said that Physical/Material Teachers and Initiation (Ritualism), are 
not always needed(though I didnt clairfy, I was speaking "Physicaly", 
as that was the context.), and in the material sence, there are very 
few material teachers qualified to give anyone else spiritual 
direction. Were in the Kali Yuga, so false prophets and false notions 
abound!
> 
> But on a side note, how many groups, that offer "Initiation", are 
actually authentic? What does even Initiation mean? To you ? To the 
TS? To sectarian groups? Is it all the same? Can you even become a 
true initiate via the TS ? or Via Masonic Lodges? or Sectarians ? And 
what is the differance between an Adept and an Initiate? 
> 
> I know many "Initiates", and have the same perception of many of 
them, that HPB had on many Masonic "Initiates" (In her writings she 
is openly critical). They simply degrade the Esoteric into Exoteric 
Dogma and have hollow ritual, that is the focal point, for a social 
club. 
> 
> My Vedic (initiate)Guru thinks all THeosophy is "Poppycock" and new 
age twaddle, so because he was initiated by someone, that means his 
word is Truth? Or does that invalidate HPBs teachings? He also thinks 
the idea of "Pre-Vedic" is "Poppycock"! Yet Ive experianced the 
direct opposite( and have half the time of study he has). So which 
of "us" is correct? Neither? Both? Either or? Things are never so 
clear and cut, in this world of Illusion.
> 
> Just food for thought my friend!
> 
> Sincerely
> 
>  BS
> 
> 
> 
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