Theos-Talk Archives (February 2009 Message tt00123)

Dear Frank,

Are you saying that 1) as EXACT figures are not given out, and 2) as
some figures were given, therefore 3) non of the figures given are exact? 

If so, any use of figures derived from HPB's work will generate
incorrect conclusions. 

Govert

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Reitemeyer" <dzyan@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Govert, hi all,
> 
> HPB states several times, that and why exact occult figures and
numbers are not be given out, which is the same as with the Jesus of
the bible, whom the editors of the gospels lay similar arguments into
his mouth.
> 
> Here is only one example:
> "For the figures belonging to the Occult calculations cannot be
given â?" as the Masters have many times declared â?" outside the
circle of pledged chelas, and not even these can break the rules."
> http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/sd/sd1-1-09.htm
> 
> Comparing her 5th sub-race quote with her other quote of the
cataclysm in 16,000 years, it is quite clear that with dead-letter
reading one comes not to the truth.
> 
> In the preface to the "Key" she states, that theosophy is not for
the mental lazy, i.e., those who study theosophy are forced to think
and by thinking they can understand theosophy and the the path becomes
the aim.
> 
> Those, who do not think, but believe blindly and/or use theosophy
for their selfing ends and pose as teachers, teaching innocent people
pseudo-theosophy, can be found guilty by a Mr Watson of being unfit to
understand the message. One, who is unfit to understand the message,
cannot be the messenger. So the message and the messanger are always a
unit.
> 
> Besant sat at the feet of the world teacher, but did not know her.
Ok, there must be always somebody, who plays the role of the bad cop.
But sad for Annie.
> HPB spoke often about the coming world wars, as Franz Hartmann
reports. She warned against an "Empire in embryo", which would bring
suffering over the world.
> Annie and Charlie in their exaggerated patriotism for the their
country and the Crown believed it was the land, where the His
Majesty's grandson ruled.
> There was but a little error in their calculations. Although Germany
was nearly destroyed by the Jeusits, as HPB states, she was in the
mean of time able to recover soon and a lot of genius souls came in
and Bismarck with the advise of an adept in the Black Forest,a s HPB
states, was able to reu-nite many German states in 1871 (without f.e.
of Holland, which decided after the Jesuit separation in 1648 from the
Reich). So, when Annie joint the TS in 1889, the new Empire was
already born (if this picture fits, because it was never really away),
therefore Germany was no embryo.
> 
> That HPB could have meant another empire with evil aims (my working
thesis), was obviously not conceivable for the two astral surfers.
> Occult doctrines misunderstood - new karma created, more suffering
for many, but the order of the Maha-Chohan fulfilled, not to interfer
with karma and give secret outs.
> So karma went its usual way without much barriers. But had
theosophists uplifted the thoughts of the masses, karma might have
been checkmated.
> 
> Frank
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: Govert Schuller 
> To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 6:44 PM
> Subject: Theos-World Re: 4th sub-race
> 
> 
> Dear Cass,
> 
> I still do not quite understand this 'blinds' bussiness, therefore I
> do not know how to agree or disagree with your statement.
> 
> Govert
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@> wrote:
> >
> > I read this the same way as you did Govert, with the blind being
> that some remain Celtic while some are Teutonic, perhaps because this
> would have been seen as overt racism when it was written - even though
> as Theosophists we know this not to be true.
> > Ã? 
> > Cass
> > 
> > --- On Wed, 4/2/09, Govert Schuller <schuller@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Govert Schuller <schuller@>
> > Subject: Theos-World Re: 4th sub-race
> > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > Received: Wednesday, 4 February, 2009, 5:22 AM
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Dear all,
> > 
> > From the quotes below (the 'dead letter' interpretation) it looks like
> > we are in Root-race 5 (Aryan), Sub-race 5 (Teutonic). Two quotes from
> > HPB and one by 'Alpha' reflecting the understanding of a member. This
> > understanding is also reflected in a little graph by Jinarajadasa,
> > which some might call the Besant-Leadbeater interpretation, but might
> > very well be in accordance with HPB. See:
> > http://users. ez2.net/nick29/ theosophy/ lessons15. htm
> > 
> > If HPB contradicted herself, and if to save her from the charge of
> > inconsistency by saying that some of her statements were blinds, in
> > what way are we to reconcile these contradictions? How do we know
> > what's a blind and what not? And if a contradiction is found and one
> > of the statements therefore allegedly a blind, does that make the
> > subject more important? Or is it possible that HPB was not able to
> > keep her globes, rounds, root races, sub-races, etc. straight because
> > of the complexity of the matter and made occasional mistakes and
> > Theosophists upon finding contradictions, would jump to the conclusion
> > that a blind was involved, even while it might have been a mistake.
> > Or, as anti-metaphysical commentators might charge, HPB's fantasies
> > became too complex for her own mind and she was not able to keep her
> > story consistent. Just thinking aloud. 
> > 
> > "I propose to show therefore, in my next, that as we are still only in
> > the 5th subrace of the Parent race, and none of us shall live to see
> > the 7thâ�"when things shall mend naturallyâ�"that it is just
as well not
> > to hang our hopes on science, whether orthodox or semi-heretical. "
> > (BCW VII, 70)
> > 
> > "At the close of every Root-Race there comes a cataclysm, in turn by
> > fire or water. Immediately after the "Fall into generation" the dross
> > of the third Root-Raceâ�"those who fell into sensuality by
falling off
> > from the teaching of the Divine Instructorsâ�"were destroyed, after
> > which the Fourth Root-Race originated, at the end of which took place
> > the last Deluge." (BCW IX, 81)
> > 
> > "Since the life-wave reached globe D in this fourth round, four
> > root-races have run their course upon it, and the fifth root-race has
> > reached its fifth subdivision or sub-race, of which we are part. This
> > fifth sub-race is said to be preparing in America for transition or
> > transformation into the sixth sub-race: it is not entirely clear
> > whether we in the United States today belong to the seventh
> > family-race of the fifth sub-race, or to the first family race of the
> > sixth sub-race. It seems certain that we are near the transition
> > point, unless there must be an intervening pralayic period." (ALPHA,
> > Path, December, 1892)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Make Yahoo!7 your homepage and win a trip to the Quiksilver
> Pro. Find out more
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
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